• Adalast@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    2
    arrow-down
    3
    ·
    1 year ago

    In this case it was a straw man argument.

    A straw man fallacy is the informal fallacy of refuting an argument different from the one actually under discussion, while not recognizing or acknowledging the distinction. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be “attacking a straw man”.

    The conversation was about how all labor is skilled labor, then you brought up an entirely audacious hyperbole about a specific career field and argued against your own example. Yes, surgeons need more training than a burger flipper, and yes, they deserve apt compensation for that disparity in time and expertise, but that does not mean that the burger flipper is “unskilled” or that the surgeon would be any more capable of flipping burgers because of their training to be a surgeon. Your “demonstration” was irrelevant to the topic at hand and constituted a bad faith argument. That is what you were being called out on, not the content of the argument itself.

    • Saledovil@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      In this case it was a straw man argument.

      Let’s take a look at the original thesis from @unfreeradical, shall we:

      Different kinds of labor take different skills, not more or less, better or worse.

      I consider ‘skill’ to be measurable by the amount of time needed to acquire it. You can take somebody fresh out of high school, and turn him into a competent fry cook in a month, but not into a competent surgeon. Hence the surgeon requires both more skill, as well as different skills. Therefore the surgeon/fry-cook example is a counterexample to the thesis, and thus disproves the thesis.

      but that does not mean that the burger flipper is “unskilled”

      I never said that burger flippers are unskilled, or that they need no training, just that 1 month is enough to learn how to do it. So, basically you’re misrepresenting my argument to claim I’ve used a straw man argument.

    • slackassassin@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      No. They said that labor did not require more or less skill. They did not say that all labor is skilled labor. You, ironically, are fighting the straw man.

          • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            arrow-down
            2
            ·
            edit-2
            1 year ago

            Your point is that if you needed surgery, then you would want it performed other than by a cook with a dirty spatula.

            Your point is meaningless.

            No one suggested that someone performing surgery would not be properly trained.

            • slackassassin@sh.itjust.works
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              That wasn’t my point because i didn’t say that. I was explaining that the person who did was only describing how having more or less skill is true using that scenario.

              • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                arrow-down
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                Skill is not a quantity.

                You identified as a quantity duration of time invested training.

                You conflated an item with one of its attributes.

                • slackassassin@sh.itjust.works
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  1 year ago

                  You can have a quantity of skill.

                  Skill is not a requirement for justice, nor is it something that should be denied from workers.

                  • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
                    link
                    fedilink
                    English
                    arrow-up
                    1
                    arrow-down
                    1
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    Skill is not a quantity, nor is it quantifiable, and your further objection embodies a straw man attack.